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    You are in: Home / Community Forums / Canning, Preserving and Dehydrating / ~ Fermentation ~ Pickles, Sauerkraut and Vegetables
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    ~ Fermentation ~ Pickles, Sauerkraut and Vegetables

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    Mon Aug 01, 2011 1:26 pm Groupie
    reya doucette wrote:
    Where in India am I from? That is the most complex question I have been trying to find an answer to most all my life icon_smile.gif, lots of people ask so finally I had to think of an answer. ...
    So thats my story and were in India I am from icon_smile.gif. Thank you for asking. ...

    Thank you so much... I thoroughly enjoyed this!
    Mon Aug 01, 2011 10:45 pm Groupie
    reya doucette wrote:
    Where in India am I from? That is the most complex question I have been trying to find an answer to most all my life icon_smile.gif, lots of people ask so finally I had to think of an answer. The details will be in my biography once I get it started. My family comes from the Punjab, and a few other places. ...

    Thanks Reya for your great commentary about India and adding your life style comments in Nova Scotia! All interesting reading. From Lahore Pakistan I went into the northern part of India, then traveled to Ceylon/Sri Lanka.... back in 1971. A long time ago, so hardly recall any special foods... but the basic Chicken and Dahl and Rice. However, I do recall the food getting very chili hot as I went further south in India. However, I now cook a lot of curry dishes and enjoy the many spices very much!

    Metro NYC

    reya doucette
    Tue Aug 02, 2011 12:50 am
    Experienced "Head Chef" Poster
    How wonderful to read you went to Lahore. The family home was 2 Stadium Road. Never been there,but postChristian conversion that is where my great-great grandfather settled. Rather he slipped away from Isa Kheil after having a vision and went to the missionaries there.
    There is some phenemonal music on Coke Studio from Pakistan on the net.
    The reason why the food gets hot the furthur south one goes is to cause one to pespire to aid in detoxing and to keep cool.
    I came to Canada in '75. We were in Bangalore in '71, preparing to move to Rajisthan, my friends and I hanging out with the American hippies who had dodged the Draft by coming to India to study. The connection with Bangalore and the Americans stems from that time, I can understand why B'lore became a tech base. I love it when people tell me they visited India. It's one way I can make a common connection.
    Calcutta had the famed Nizams byrani. Unmatched. I'm trying to duplicate the flavour-have been trying for 20 years icon_sad.gif.
    You got to see India. That is lovely. Most people go to one place and say they've been to India. You can tell them no unless they travel fairly extensively. Did you notice the difference in architecture between North and South. What took you to India?
    Tue Aug 02, 2011 12:29 pm Groupie
    Hello Reya,

    I am sorry to say this is a Fermentation Thread and not exactly correct for us to go into details about India or traveling....

    However, I will just add a few comments relating to food and fermentation. In Istanbul, Turkey and Tehran, Iran they had the greatest spicy picked vegetables (fermentation, cured) in barrels/at street vendors. I would get a plastic bag of them and eat as I went along. I also loved the yogurt drinks in Istanbul and also the wonderful tasty yogurts in Iran. I don't recall foods in Afghanistan (other the shis kabobs), but in Pakistan, yes kabobs and other foods. I also, recall some yogurt in India in which they added some lemon to milk and waited I guess a day for it to thicken. The food was very spicy in India and also in Ceylon.... and we often went to local Chinese restaurants as well.

    "Calcutta had the famed Nizams byrani" I did a Google search on this and have to look into this further and try it... I guess Chicken and Lamb!
    I use a paperback book Madhur Jaffrey's Indian Cooking... and there is one recipe Lamb and rice casserole-Mughlai Lamb Biryani.... which I will try one day. I also have other Asian cook books and have to check them out as well, for Byrani recipes. And yes there are many recipes, but will have to again look into ones by Nizams and from Calcutta.

    Have a tasty food day....

    Metro NYC
    reya doucette
    Tue Aug 02, 2011 2:46 pm
    Experienced "Head Chef" Poster
    When it comes to pickling and fermentation, I have a question and have not found an answer to it. Hope someone can help.
    In India we make meat pickles, I have them on my page here, these pickles are kept in jars in a cool spot - if there can be such a thing in Inda most places - and they keep very well for the time stated - no refrigiration. I also noticed cooked foods would be kept out overnight. No salmonella, no spoiling.
    When I tried this in Canada, and someone in Toronto too who had a cool basement spot, within the week mold appeared on the surface. Why would this be?
    Far Eastern pickles are very interesting too. Very time and labour intensive - but o so good!
    I like travel stories related to foods and how people discovered the recipe and their experience with it.
    Nizams closed in Calcutta because of labour endless disputes. The sons opened a branch in New Delhi I am told. There are many, many byrani recipes, each unique to the composer. The history of them can be found on The site owner has a passion for Indian food and chemestry. Anyone interested can check the site out for super pickles and other Indian foods, the North American substitutes etc. Very informative.
    Thanks for taking me on your travel/food journey with your stories. Love them. Lends character to a food name.
    Tue Aug 02, 2011 8:35 pm Groupie
    Hello Reya,

    Maybe there is less spoilage in India because they use more spices that kill the bad bacteria???? A wild guess??? This link does not work...
    Anyway, googling I came up with many URLs about Nisam's Byrani recipes... and restaurants. And I see it is a world wide challenge for everyone to come up with the best Nisam Byrani.... Mutton. So who knows which one is the very best! Some day I will get to try one of the recipes I found on the internet.

    reya doucette
    Tue Aug 02, 2011 9:31 pm
    Experienced "Head Chef" Poster
    It's not the spices - used the same here.
    Thank you for the suggestion. Someone said it probably has to do with the artificial air conditioning in North American homes.
    O when making India pickles/food, I use spices from Indian food stores that get the spices grown in India. They have a different flavour-soil and weather composition I suppose.
    Believe me Nizam's byrani is/was so renouned, Calcutta put it on it's tourist must visit places, inspite of all the other restaurants that are there, this is the only restaraunt mentioned on the official site. People all over India speak about it, and some go there just for the meal, including kati kebabs wrapped in egg parathas. Unmatched. The secret is in the 'garam masala' combination, and there are hundreds of them. Still trying combinations out as I try and capture that particular flavour.
    Tue Aug 02, 2011 10:22 pm Groupie
    Hi Reya,

    There is a big difference in my pickling (no canning, heated jars) from when I let it ferment in a warm living room (no A/C)in the summer and when I do the same in winter with a cooler living room. It ferments faster in summer... So I think the difference is the warm climate in India and cooler climate in Nova Scotia/Toronto???

    I have never tasted the Nizam Byrani (Mutton) or other Byrani's so I would have no clue if it was like the one from their restaurant. However, I am also assuming you have tasted the Nizam dishes, so can compare your cooking to the "Real Deal" the authentic recipe.

    New York City has a nice size population of Indian Sub-Continent people. In Queens (one of the five boroughs within New York City), the Indian area has big supermarkets and all sorts of spices... including fresh vegetables! I was there last week and bought some spices. Also, I have to be on the lookout for some restaurants that might have the Nizam Bryani style dishes??? Or at least Nizam Bryani Mutton.

    Aside- Sometimes it is extremely hard to duplicate a recipe, ingredients. And often some of my favorite restaurants go out of business and I can't get the dishes I had liked. For example, my brother used to go to an Indian restaurant (closed now) and got s great Indian soup... but now we just can't duplicate the soup.

    reya doucette
    Wed Aug 03, 2011 1:46 am
    Experienced "Head Chef" Poster
    One day I will get to the bottom of the Indian meat pickling in NA problem. Maybe the heat in India kills the spoiling process.
    Sorry Yogi taught me a lot about Indian cooking. You will enjoy the site. He told me one of the Mughal emperor's wives during war while in Hyderabad, South India, realized it was too time consuming to cook seperate rice and curry for the military troops. So she invented Byrani where both are cooked together in one pot. Many variations. Many restaurants opened in the name of Nizam's. The only one and first was in Calcutta, and now his sons opened in Delhi. Nizam means 'ruler'. Enjoy the site. You can check out Vah Chief on YouTube. He is from Hydrabad, awesome recipes. Both have pickles. I know what you mean about restaurants shutting down and not getting favorite foods as a result.
    Indian soup. Hmm. I'll send you the one in my mother's cook book. Was the soup very sour? Was it a North or South Indian restaurant? South would be 'Russam' or pepper water in translation.
    Wed Aug 03, 2011 7:05 pm Groupie

    Thanks for the corrected URL indiacurry... I will check it out.

    My brother said the name of the soup was Mulligatawny Soup. Here is a recipe on food dot com.

    I have made this soup before and it is a popular one... and I am sure there are many variations.

    Further, since a lot of our posts should be on the Asian Community Forum, I have started a new thread in that Forum:
    Nizams Byrani and Indian Recipes

    reya doucette
    Thu Aug 04, 2011 12:50 am
    Experienced "Head Chef" Poster
    Mullagatanni, aah. Here is the take on Mullagatanni, it's origin, which is far removed from the European and North American takes on it. Most people do not know what the word means and where it originates from. The Nazi soup was made popular by the tv show, forget the name now. Most ingredients are not Indian either. The only commonality with the original is chicken broth, lemon juice - curry powder depending on the spices used. The rest of the ingredients are not local to India.
    Mullagatanni = is an Anglo Indian soup composed by Mrs Ruthledge a resident of Madras, now Chennai. When Indian women became involved with British men, or married them, they redesigned the local Indian foods to meet the British palettes as domestic recipes. The Anglo Indian recipes took on a life of their own, and are very distinct. Depending on where the person was from, the flavours took on the local flavour. In Tamil, the language of Madras, Mullaga means Pepper, Tanni means Water. It has a rich but delicate and light flavour with a coconut base which is staple to coastal regions of India. I inherited my mother's Mrs Ruthledge's cookbook. Mullagatanni became a family recipe and very popular during family gatherings. I cater the soup here, and package the spice mix which I sell along with instructions on how to make the soup. If it becomes possible I will send you a batch if you like so you can have the original and have it as a point of reference. It was Mrs Ruthledge's Mullagatanni that became famous and thereafter lots of variations happened and the source has become obscured. My friends here describe the soup as being very Gourmet. I have been on the look out for a high-end restaurant that might be interested in serving the soup. Please share this information with your brother on my behalf. Mullagatanni is not popular in India and is little known. Being a cultural recipe it was not adopted by the general population. Each State stays with it's own local cusine. So Mullagatanni is not really an Indian recipe. It is an Anglo-Indian composition from Madras, South India. The traditional South Indian 'soup' would be Rassam which has a water stock lots of black pepper, salt, tamrind, sometimes with a very little lentil, garlic and sprinkling of fresh cilantro(dhanya). This is the original basic to which one can add tomatoes, but that's about it. It is a great cold remedy(the pepper and tamrind for vitamin C.
    I will check out the site you included. Indiacurry is the best site on Indian foods because of all the research and historical information. I loved the Marajuana recipes icon_smile.gif. North Indian used during festivals mostly Holy(Spring festival)when they throw colour on each other. Great amplifier of happiness. One needs to be aware of this when attending festivals in India at friends homes and watch out for the sweets. No one makes a fuss about it, just don't eat the foods in which it is used and the host or hostess will let you know. Socially it is accepted during these occasions and to eat the sweets is left to personal choice.
    Did you make it to Rishikeish and meet up with the Shivites? They live in a constant state of blissful Nirvana - stoned all the time. Once again accepted and normal for them, no one makes a fuss. It just is a way of life for this group.
    Leggy Peggy
    Thu Aug 04, 2011 8:37 am Groupie
    This thread is fascinating and I'm so grateful to Skipper/Sy for pointing it out.
    I can't really get involved in the conversation right now as I am travelling overland'from London to Sydney on the back of a truck--
    we're in Azerbaijan right now—but I look forward to re-visiting this thread for
    the info about Indian pickling, when I get back to Australia in December.

    P.S. The Asian Forum has a general chat thread where conversations about
    food, culture, travel or any other subject are most welcome.
    All are welcome—
    reya doucette
    Thu Aug 04, 2011 8:47 am
    Experienced "Head Chef" Poster
    Australia, what fun! Original authentic foods and habits would be wild and in their natural state. But it would be great if you could find info on the subject and let us know. Have a great trip.
    Thu Aug 04, 2011 10:50 am Groupie

    Go to the Asian Forum... for a reply on the Mullagatanni Soup-


    reya doucette
    Thu Aug 04, 2011 11:54 pm
    Experienced "Head Chef" Poster
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