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    You are in: Home / Community Forums / Breads & Baking / Baking with Wild Yeast Sourdough Starters--IV
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    Baking with Wild Yeast Sourdough Starters--IV

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    Red Apple Guy
    Sun Sep 18, 2011 3:00 pm
    Forum Host
    Thanks Bonnie. I don't take pictures when I spill paint all over the canvas. icon_lol.gif

    These breads aren't hard to make. High hydration, autolyze, sretch and folds, gentle shaping and a hot steamy oven. And it doesn't take sourdough unless you want it. A slow rise is important.

    Red
    awalde
    Mon Sep 19, 2011 12:19 pm
    Food.com Groupie
    Hi everybody!
    Looking around I found you here.
    I'm interested to know more about sourdough, but for the moment I will not try.
    The reason? We are living in Switzerland very close to the German border. Where I'm living we are using mostly yeast, but in Germany the sourdough is very common. My husband is not a fan of the German sourdough bread, but I think that there are a lot of different breads with this.
    I think that the artisanal bread (like the bread with big holes done by Red) could match my husband's taste.
    I found out that in Greece they have very light sourdough breads.
    Looking for a special Greek recipe, I found an interesting page that explains how to prepare the Greek sourdough. The site is in Italian (my mother tongue), but here down the "Google translation". What do you think about this procedure? Link

    1 st day : Take ½ cup of flour (about 70 grams) and add enough warm water to obtain an elastic dough. Place in a bowl or a glass jar and cover with a plate (not to be hermetically sealed) and keep it at room temperature.

    2 nd day : Add to 'previous day's dough ½ cup of flour, enough water so that it again reaches the initial stock and put it back into the bowl. Cover up the next day.

    Continue like this every day, with the same procedure that is called "refresh" until the yeast is mature, that doubles its volume in 2-3 hours.
    When we see that it is ready, take the amount we need to make bread and the rest of the refresh and put it in a glass jar with its lid closed in the refrigerator.
    For refreshments following, which occur about every 4-5 days, I do this: if, for example, I put forward 80 grams of yeast, I add 80 grams of flour and about 40-45 grams of water. This depends on the type of flour and its absorption capacity because the yeast mixture should be neither too hard nor too soft.
    So I leave it at room temperature for several hours and then put it back in the fridge.

    IMPORTANT: to accelerate the maturation of the yeast, early on, I put the bowl with the dough in the kitchen, the cabinet higher up where I put the pasta (I could combine that smells ...) and I placed a close apple.
    Bonnie G #2
    Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:01 pm
    Food.com Groupie
    wave.gif awalde, I'm so glad you've come around here, I think you'll really love the sourdough bread that's been made. There are so many starters. I once tried to make my own but didn't have much luck myself so some wonderful folks from this site sent me some flakes that you reconstitute and that made the process sooooo much easier.

    Can't wait to see what you decide to do. icon_biggrin.gif
    Red Apple Guy
    Wed Sep 21, 2011 11:36 am
    Forum Host
    awalde, I'll echo Bonnie G's welcome and also say it's good to have you on the bread forums.

    Switzerland is the most beautiful country I've seen. We visted Lauterbrunnen in the 70's and I loved it. I recently made a recipe that was supposedly common to the Bern Canton, but I'd love to see some Swiss bread recipes. I hear the flour is different there from here.

    The sourdough starter you described is a "stiff" starter and should be a good one. My starter is wetter than that (equal weights flour and water) and several folks here use liquid starters (equal volumes flour and water). They all work, all can be converted to use in any recipe and each has different characteristics.

    The holey bread you mentioned can be made with dried yeast. Just use small amounts which takes longer to rise than normal amounts.

    Red
    awalde
    Thu Sep 22, 2011 5:32 pm
    Food.com Groupie
    Hi Red! Thanks for your interest.
    I have already some Swiss bread recipes!
    Zopf or Braided Bread #437716
    Walnuts and Potatoes Bread #445259
    Fastenwhe (Carnival Caraway-Seed Pretzel of Basel) #446613

    I live in Basel at the border of Germany and France.
    I confess I try a lot of different flour, but I use also a lot of the simplest one as well.
    Sometimes I buy ready-flour-mixtures that I adapt to my taste.

    If I understood well, the holey breads need a longer time to "digest" the flour and make the dough more elastic. Isn't it?

    In some books they write about high gluten flour such as Manitoba, but here in Switzerland it is not clear which one they mean.
    Sometimes passing through Italy I buy "hard wheat flour" that I use (mixed with usual flour) for pizza and similar kind of bread.

    There is a main bread recipe in my family. This is our Saturday and Sunday bread for breakfast the Zopf or Braided Bread!

    And you do you have your favorite?
    awalde
    Thu Sep 22, 2011 5:33 pm
    Food.com Groupie
    Bonnie G #2 wrote:
    wave.gif awalde, I'm so glad you've come around here, I think you'll really love the sourdough bread that's been made. There are so many starters. I once tried to make my own but didn't have much luck myself so some wonderful folks from this site sent me some flakes that you reconstitute and that made the process sooooo much easier.

    Can't wait to see what you decide to do. icon_biggrin.gif


    Hi Bonnie! Glad see you here!
    Red Apple Guy
    Thu Sep 22, 2011 7:32 pm
    Forum Host
    awalde wrote:
    Hi Red! Thanks for your interest.
    I have already some Swiss bread recipes!
    Zopf or Braided Bread #437716
    Walnuts and Potatoes Bread #445259
    Fastenw�he (Carnival Caraway-Seed Pretzel of Basel) #446613

    I live in Basel at the border of Germany and France.
    I confess I try a lot of different flour, but I use also a lot of the simplest one as well.
    Sometimes I buy ready-flour-mixtures that I adapt to my taste.

    If I understood well, the holey breads need a longer time to "digest" the flour and make the dough more elastic. Isn't it?

    In some books they write about high gluten flour such as Manitoba, but here in Switzerland it is not clear which one they mean.
    Sometimes passing through Italy I buy "hard wheat flour" that I use (mixed with usual flour) for pizza and similar kind of bread.

    There is a main bread recipe in my family. This is our Saturday and Sunday bread for breakfast the Zopf or Braided Bread!

    And you do you have your favorite?

    I've been reading your Zopf recipe and will check out the others.

    All I know about the flours in Europe is that protein (gluten) levels are lower than the hard wheats here in the states I grind hard red wheat for the whole wheat loaves I make and the protein level is 14% or more. For white flour, I like a brand here - King Arthur flour that has very strict specifcations. I have access to all purpose white flour (11% protein) and bread flour (14%).

    Long rising times (low yeast levels) help with holey bread, but mostly improve flavor. I'm not sure about elasticity. You know, holey artisan breads come from your neck of the woods, not over here. We're just copying you folks.

    Thanks for the info.

    Red Apple Guy
    awalde
    Fri Sep 23, 2011 1:55 pm
    Food.com Groupie
    I will have a check about the content of protein in my flours. This is very interesting, I will look at this more conscious icon_smile.gif. As saw that the protein content of my all purpose flour is “only” 9.8 %.
    Nevertheless I don’t have problems preparing my breads.
    I posted a question in http://www.food.com/bb/viewtopic.zsp?t=363924 about the kind of oven used in the countries.
    I realized that the Swiss standard (convection oven) in not very common in the new world.
    This means that the baking time or temperature is affected by the oven used.
    There are tables for recalculations, but I confess, if I’m baking someone else recipe, I don’t follow the baking time/temperature mentioned; as I know that not all oven work in the same way.
    Myself I have 2 ovens (a standard sized and a smaller combined with microwave). I know that I cannot relay to the time/temperature suggested in the recipe and I prefer to check from time to time.
    I like browned bread, many people prefer the light and soft ones! I prefer to cook it more than less.
    Thanks a lot for the interesting information! I’m learning a lot new things with you!
    Red Apple Guy
    Thu Sep 29, 2011 9:26 pm
    Forum Host
    I was in Little Rock for a few days and Sis asked me to make some sourdough biscuits. Instead of admitting I haven't ever done sourdough biscuits, I tossed 60g of starter into my usual buttermilk biscuit recipe and adjusted the consistency. Surprisingly, they were very good but not as fluffy as I like due to overworking the dough. The next day I made regular, fluffy buttermilk biscuits and nobody said much. The third day, Sis asked again for sourdough biscuits. Seems they taste a lot better than my regular biscuits.
    So, try adding some starter to your favorite recipe for buttermilk biscuits and see how you like them. It doesn't take much.

    Red
    duonyte
    Mon Oct 10, 2011 3:32 pm
    Forum Host
    Red, try these biscuits, they are wonderful, Grandma's Sourdough Biscuits
    \
    I really did get up in the middle of the night to make more of them.... icon_redface.gif
    Red Apple Guy
    Wed Oct 12, 2011 8:02 am
    Forum Host
    Thatta girl. Nothing like biscuit passion.

    I will try those - simple.

    Red
    HeatherS6709
    Mon Nov 07, 2011 5:34 pm
    Newbie "Fry Cook" Poster
    Great article, it couldn't be easier following the recipe.
    duonyte
    Wed Nov 09, 2011 4:31 pm
    Forum Host
    Heather, welcome - if you have a few minutes, perhaps you would add your review to the recipe. Those reviews are so helpful to others who are thinking about making any recipe posted on this site. Hope to see you again!
    Red Apple Guy
    Fri Dec 09, 2011 10:43 am
    Forum Host
    Hey fellow sourdoughers!!! We haven't posted anything in a month! Surely you've been baking some sourdough, I know I have soured a dough or two. I just haven't taken any pictures or posted anything.

    This week I made some San Francisco Sourdough. The starter was made on day 1, the dough on day 2 and the loaves on day 3 with the rest of the time as frig time. Good flavor, awesome bubbly crust, and so-so crumb.

    What have you made lately or what will you be planning for Christmas?

    Red
    Galley Wench
    Fri Dec 09, 2011 10:47 am
    Food.com Groupie
    The recipe for your SFO bread sounds very similar to my favorite recipe. Love that I don't have to bake all on the same day . . . it makes three loaves total.

    Finishing up a 2 pound sourdough Rye Bread . . . it to is a three day process. Baking it in my Romertopf clay baker. We're going to a gourmet club dinner tonight and I'm in charge of bread (go figure) and sweet and sour cabbage!
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